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Thread: Cache Placement Permission

  1. #1

    Cache Placement Permission

    Webmaster, please pin (sticky) this to the top of the forum!

    Permission to hide a cache is becoming a real and dangerous issue in our game... enough so that I want to highlight the requirement here!

    The following is a cross-posting where I addressed this with a now-archived cache:

    ... who gets the permission? Should we be going to every business and shop in the area to ask if it okay for us to look around on the edge of the parking lot near their shop?
    No, you shouldn't. Groundspeak Cache Listing Guidelines clearly require that the hider gain permission for the hide.

    It is in fact the first line of the Guidelines.

    When hiders create a listing page they must click two checkboxes, attesting that they have read both the Cache Listing Guidelines and Terms of Service and will abide by them.

    This is what makes our game work - geocachers trust that the hider has done as promised and can assume that permission has been given.

    If anything threatens our game it is caches hidden without permission.

    What territory we have lost, and the land-use issues we have today, are almost all directly attributable to past hider's failure to live up to this permission commitment.

    Or does the placer have that responsibility? I went with the thought that it it was placed there it was OK to look for it, especally on the edge of a public parking lot.
    Yes, you should be able to assume that listings have permission... the hider has stated that it does!

    As a Reviewer I have to trust that the hider has permission, based on the commitment made by checking those two boxes on the Cache Listing Submission page, and get quite leery about listing an individual's caches once it has been proven that they do not do this!

    If I have to archive two caches by a hider due to permission issues I will ask for a permission contact for all future caches.

    But I was informed by the owner and the police that there is no such thing as PUBLIC property, that that lot was for parking to go to the shops ONLY to and from the car, anything else was Trespassing
    They're right! All property in the continental US is owned by someone.

    All property managers set land use rules - be it a State Park, National Forest, cemetary, Wal-Mart or strip mall parking lot or city sidewalk, it's all owned and regulated.

    Many people do not understand that there is no such thing as public land - only land designated for Public Use... a big difference! All Public Use lands, just like all private lands, have Land Use Rules... that's why parks have Rangers!

    Private lands such as mall parking lots generally allow access only during specific hours for the specific purposes of servicing or doing business with the businesses there located. Private Security and Public Police enforce these policies.

    Please, geocachers, file a Should Be Archived note anytime you have knowledge that the hide does not meet the Guideline's permission requirement.

    Failure to get permission will only result in more geocachers being hassled and more restrictions on available placement territories.

    Ed

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Sep 2004
    Location
    Ridgway, CO
    Posts
    454

    Sherwood

    Fish,
    Are all the Sherwood caches archived at this point?? Looks like TopKitty archived those she owns. Any thoughts about those in the Sherwood city parks? Onward SJC

  3. #3

    Sherwood

    Are all the Sherwood caches archived at this point??
    No, only the cache in question has been archived, since I have recieved no permission info on it.

    So far as I know all of the other caches in Arkansas have permission, since the owners so stated when they listed the hide... and geocachers would never fool their Reviewer, would they?

    Ed

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Location
    Morrilton
    Posts
    327

    Re: Cache Placement Permission

    Quote Originally Posted by NatureFish
    Permission to hide a cache is becoming a real and dangerous issue in our game... enough so that I want to highlight the requirement here!
    ......
    It is in fact the first line of the Guidelines.
    ......
    If anything threatens our game it is caches hidden without permission.
    Two years ago I was told by a skeptical land manager that I would have to make my request before the full City Council (which I never did.) On another occasion I was flat denied by a different land manager. There are now caches in both of these areas. Granted, attitudes could have changed since then but I fear that too often we are too quick to check off the check boxes without complying with all the requirements, in particular the requirement for permission.

    Even though I am sure the residents would not object, cemeteries probably have an owner or manager that might have definite feelings one way or the other.

    Geezer
    (Yep, this time I'm being a real Geezer)


    Take time to smell the roses and love the grandkids.

  5. #5

    Permission

    Though this was an Alabama incident I want to post it here as a reminder and appeal!

    Please pay attention to permission and land-owner rights!

    Incidents that hurt our game are growing in number and forcing me to pay more attention to and demand more proof of permission from hiders.

    Incidents like this:

    [quote:1w52heu3]
    4/26/2006 quick profile LaPaglia archived it Alabama [visit log]
    Recieved at Groundspeak email.
    -----------
    located a army ammo can containing several items
    the can is marked with www.geocaching.com and the name deejayh written on
    the side of the can.
    the can was located on hobbs island on the tennessee river in huntsville
    alabama by the property owner.the property owner contacted the madison
    county sheriffs office on 04-26-06.
    hobbs island is private proerty.please contact this person and advise him
    that the property is off limits and is privatly owneed.
    -----------------------

    embarrass me, focus attention from Groundspeak on our state, and cost us the good will of landowners and access to lands.

    Just a few stories like this circulating make it much easier for landowners to just say no in order to protect themselves from geocachers who refuse to follow our own rules, much less theirs.[/quote:1w52heu3]

    Ed

  6. #6
    Please unpin this topic and let it gracefully slide off the page, more information will be coming in a few weeks

    Max Cacher
    Geocaching.com Volunteer Cache Reviewer

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