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Thread: Ouachita National Forest Caching

  1. #41
    Team Panda Guest
    Quote Originally Posted by AR-HICK
    This is the person whom needs to convinced that we are not trying to rape the land. All that we want to do is place a few caches in a Beautiful part of our state and enjoy the National Forest.

    I am sure that the search is on for this person and the Board will do their best to convince them of our intentions. The Board convinced the Arkansas State Parks to allow Geocaching and I have faith that the same will happen with this problem.
    Hey Mike!

    I'm really glad you posted this because it perfectly illustrates what I'm talking about.

    The person who made the decision is exactly the person you DON'T want to contact. After all, they thought it was a good idea or they wouldn't have done it to start with. Trying to "unsell" a bureaucrat on their own idea is usually going to be a pretty fruitless proposition.

    Instead, far better to seek out this person's immediate supervisor. Their boss will not be nearly as dedicated to preserving the decision as the actual decision maker was, they don't have a personal stake in it and are able to be far more objective about the matter.

    I am neither a skillful reader or writer and I do have friends on the board. I have the utmost faith in their judgement and abilities. You may not agree with the path they take, as long as it gets you where you want to go.
    Don't sell yourself short, it's pretty obvious you're smarter than you would like most folks to believe.

    I have friends on the board as well. If I knew for a fact that any one them was going to handle the matter personally, and as an individual rather than acting on behalf of a board they must answer to, I'd probably be resting a lot easier on this matter. But that isn't the case. So, instead of dealing with my friends I am forced to deal with what seems to be a surprisingly amorphous Board of Directors.

    Given my druthers, I'd rather deal with my friends.

  2. #42
    Geezer_Veazey Guest
    Quote Originally Posted by Parrot Parents
    Sir, in spite of repeated reading of this post it makes no sense whatsoever. Can you please clarify???
    I'm trying hard to make sense but not having much luck.

  3. #43
    mountainborn Guest
    We have around thirty caches placed in a loop in the National Forest. It is obviously a concern for us. At $57.00 per cache, that is a "wad of jack" for a hillbilly to have to cough up.
    Yet, though we are worried about it, we believe that our duly elected represenatives will do what is in our best intrest.
    It is counter productive to attack the board, or individuals. If the issue is worrying you, and you just must attack something to relieve the stress, then attack the issue, not the person.
    It will be hard for our elected represenatives to function at their best level if they are being attacked from within.

  4. #44
    Team Panda Guest
    Quote Originally Posted by mountainborn
    It is counter productive to attack the board, or individuals. If the issue is worrying you, and you just must attack something to relieve the stress, then attack the issue, not the person.
    It will be hard for our elected represenatives to function at their best level if they are being attacked from within.
    Attacking?

    If I ask questions and expect answers from elected board members, I'm attacking them? That's an interesting form of "Democracy" you have there. Ask yourself what kind of governments use that type of logic.

    As for attacking the issues, I'd love to! I'd REALLY love to.

    As soon as some one will start telling me what those issues are.

    I don't want a fight, I don't want an argument, and I don't want to attack anyone. But what should have been a simple request for information from the Board of Directors is turning into quite a painful ordeal, isn't it?

    Well NEWSFLASH folks,

    It ain't me causing the pain.

  5. #45
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    Morrilton,Ar
    Posts
    52
    I'm not much on the arguing part of this thread and I don't know a whole lot of big words. I did read somewhere at the beginning of all this that all suggestions and comments were welcome. I am far from having a solution but I have done a little research about other parks and national lands in other states to see what the "norm" might be, about all of them require a permit for a physical cache, some only allow virtuals, one in particular required the owner of the cache to check on it personally every 30 days and respond to their local ranger district about the well being of the cache, there were many different rules and some of them just said "NO GEOCACHING ALLOWED". If you would like further info go to "USASEARCH.GOV", type in geocaching and read until your heart is content. I know I will get slammed for posting this because what happens in other states has no effect on this matter, I just thought the best way I could help was to give folks other ideas we might use to approach this, take some of the rules from these other places that sound resonable and take that to our national forest "powers that be". None of the other states I read about charged a fee. I do fully understand the forest wanting to keep track of what people are putting in the woods. I will keep looking for more info on geocaching in protected areas and hope this will help give ideas to those that are trying to come up with a solution.

  6. #46

  7. #47
    Dentful1 Guest
    Sounds like OEnavigator has been doing some homework. A great job at it too. He mentioned that the FS has contacted the organization and had a chance for all to voice concerns and we dropped the ball on it. I hope and pray that we get a second chance at this.

    We also need to come up with a figure as to how many caches are actually within the NF itself statewide and just the Ouachita Forest for comparisons. This will give us a great view as to the impact of use of the Forests will recieve if we all archive the caches.

    I know I brought this subject up and I am glad I did. I did not mean for this to get out of hand. I also know that the Panda's are "gentle creatures" and his posts need not offend anyone. The Panda's are just wanting answers just like the rest of us. The quicker the better I might add. We do need to address this issue, but an all out war of words won't do anything but draw lines within our own organization.
    Perhaps we need to relax a bit, I know, how about a nice float on the Caddo River next Saturday the 17th. That would be relaxing and for those that need to vent can take out their "anger" by dragging their canoe across the shallow currents.

  8. #48
    mountainborn Guest
    When someone's NAME is caled more than once, then the word YOU is used more that FIFTY times, it is hard to imagine that it was not a PERSONAL ATTACK.

  9. #49
    Team Panda Guest
    Okay, now you're counting how many times I used the word "you."

    You know (Darn, I used it again!) I'm not going to back off of this.It's too important an issue to allow you (ACK! AGAIN!) to cloud the issue with something this ridiculous.

    You (EEP! HUSH MA MOUF!) can not make me back off this by trying to make me feel like I'm a bully. I have a right to ask questions of the board and expect real answers rather than semi-polite brushoffs.

    I've asked my questions and I'm going to continue asking them until I get satisfactory answers to them. Frankly, I can't think of any good reasons why those answersweren't provided two days ago. OENavigator didn't have any trouble "gathering information" maybe HE should be running the Board. (Except I wouldn't wish that on him.)

    As for my use of the word "you" fifty times (I'm taking your word for it, God knows I have better things to do than count them myself!) I think I made it perfectly clear, that with a few exceptions directed to Wayne, the use of the word "you" was directed to the Board of Directors as a whole.

    You (Oh Lordy, can't sombody STOP ME?) can choose to believe otherwise if you (~sob!~) wish, at this point I'm rapidly losing interest in who is angry at me and who is not. If you CHOOSE to be insulted, you will find insults everywhere. If you CHOOSE to take offense, you will find offense whether it is there or not.

    Either way, the choice is yours and nothing I say or do will affect it.

    THE SIMPLE TRUTH IS THIS. THE ONLY THING REQUIRED TO INSTANTLY TURN ME FROM OPPONENT TO ALLY IS TO ANSWER THE QUESTIONS.

    I don't want the questions answered simply to gratify my curiosity, nor do I want the answers posted simply for my own benefit. I ask the questions because we, the Geocachers of Arkansas, need to know what's going on if we wish to do anything meaningful to address this problem.

    But then, I guess that makes me the badguy. Fine, I'll be the badguy.

    But good guy or bad, I still want to know what the Board of Directors intends to do about this matter.

    Sincerely,

    Evil Rotten No Good Ken
    (Gimme a break, just give us some answers, huh?)
    [/b]

  10. #50
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    Madison, AL
    Posts
    321
    Wheeww! Everybody take a breath, step back a minute, and remember we are all on the same team here!
    Just a passing thought, the ONF extends into Oklahoma. I believe they have an organization or two, or more. God forbid that we side up with the okies , but the more soldiers we have, the better our odds are against Big Brother.
    This is an issue of vital importance to us who are surrounded as far as the eye can see by the NF. As Ken mentioned earlier, if you live in the area where we do, by the time you take out the off limits National Park territory, there is basicly ONF left. I think part of Ken's frustration, is that it seems like this is a MAJOR issue to a few, but a minor inconvenience to most.
    I hope that we can get this thing resolved, but more important, to me any way, is that we emerge from this, still as friends. I know this may sound simplistic to some, but is of great importance to me. A smart guy once told me that it is more important to be kind than to be right. I hope we can remember that.
    Guess what?! I got a fever, and the only prescription...is more cowbell!!

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